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MMT responds to their critics
This is a great clarifying piece from the thought leaders of MMT responding to their critics. They make the point to differentiate between a generalized description of money mechanics vs. specific implementation like the U.S. model. As has pointed out in the past, they clearly understand how the U.S. system clearly works under today’s self selected fiscal and legal constraints, such as the TGA must be funded prior to spending, no Treasury overdraft at the Fed, and the Fed cannot buy bonds directly from the Treasury. Supporters of MMT often conflate the need for the Fed/CB to create new Reserves by spending or lending, with the Treasury creating new reserves by Gov spending, but which the authors do not. Anything here anybody would like to point out or discuss? Anything anybody would like to add?
1 like • Dec '25
@Jon Underwood I still have lots to read, so please be patient. 1. "How do you define Fiat? Reserves or Deposits?" => DEPOSITS 2. "Treasury transfers Reserves to banks, but it’s the banks who create the new bank Liabilities on their balance sheets, new bank IOUs to their customer, not the gov. Gov spending does not create new deposits, it causes banks to create new deposits and new bank Liabilities when the receiver of the payment is a bank customer." I cannot dispute the mechanics of this, but I think the bank is just acting as an intermediary, as it always does. If I make a direct transfer to your account, it is your bank which "creates the new bank liabilities on their balance sheet" - but that does not mean that your bank is creating new money. Is money being destroyed and created? You could say that, but we only drive ourselves nuts if we say this is an example of money creation. My financial assets reduce and yours increase, so I am transferring the money to you - just as the government does when it spends. That's all for now. I will continue reading.
1 like • Dec '25
You seem to think that reserves are money. This is probably the root of the disagreement. Reserves are not money and they are never the property of "the public", so treasury cannot borrow reserves from the public. Not possible. All the fiat money in deposit accounts, is backed, mirrored or shadowed by bank assets - specifically, the total sum of reserves and bonds held by banks. (Actually, the total of reserves plus bonds is more than the sum of depositors' fiat money, because these banking assets also include bank equity, which does not exist in deposit accounts.) Anyway, money is added to the economy when the total of reserves + bonds held by banks increases. The reserves held by treasury do not mirror any part of the money supply until they are transferred to the banking system as part of government spending. The total pool of reserves does not change in this process, but money is created when reserves are transferred to a payee's bank when the government pays someone in the private sector. New money is created and the amount of reserves owned by banks increases by the corresponding amount. However treasury's ability to continue spending will be impaired unless it can replenish its reserve account at the Fed. If the flow of taxation is not enough to replenish reserves, treasury can "soak up" the excess reserves left over by its untaxed spending, by offering bonds to the banks in exchange for their excess reserves. This is the other half of the fiat money creation process. This is how the government creates the new liabilities which is an essential component of creating new fiat money. If you want to define the money supply to include all reserves, including the TGA, plus the sum of all bonds, including those in the hands of the the FED, then you are going to get mathematical nonsense. However, you might define the fiat money supply as being equal to the sum of all bond assets held by the banking system including those held at the Fed - but excluding bonds in the hands of the public (non-bank private sector). This definition would be close to a numerical equivalent, because it is a reflection of the money supply, rather than the money supply itself, but it would also be large enough to include reserves in the TGA. I say this because bonds held by the Fed ought to equal the total of all reserves - including those in the TGA.
Information - in physics and economics
This might seem well off-topic, but I think there is a strong underlying connection with economics. Two slightly-rebellious physicists make a case for the treatment of information as being fundamentally missing in current physics. During my career as a signal-processing engineer, I’d often thought the same. But in my part of that discipline, information always had the context of a human source and sink - so subjectivity was giving the raw, bit-based Shannon-measure its meaning, via an interpretation of human significance and purpose. See the Aeon article ‘Is information a fundamental force in the universe’ with 10-minute video at https://aeon.co/videos/a-radical-reimagining-of-physics-puts-information-at-its-centre and the Quanta article ‘Why Everything in the Universe Turns More Complex’ at https://www.quantamagazine.org/why-everything-in-the-universe-turns-more-complex-20250402/ Both Lee Smolin and Ilya Prigogine have argued for a reinterpretation of the role of time in physics, but not from an informational standpoint. For sure, the 2nd law of thermodynamics in a closed system demands a decrease in order with time. Yet the history of both the universe and of the life in it deals with open systems, and rather obviously is characterised by the exact opposite process - an increase of order over time. That’s what these two physicists suggest should extend physics, through finding another route to reach significance without requiring subjectivity, via what they describe as a functional sub-set of information in its Shannon-measure. I’d say the link with economics comes through the processes that the various schools of orthodox economics (Physiocrats likely excepted) have devised to move from observation of an individual trade or exchange to an overall, aggregated description of a whole sector or an entire economy. I’m thinking of things (at the macro level) such as:
2 likes • Nov '25
Thank you so much for posting the links to those articles, Alwyn. The idea of a "creative force" has always got entangled with religious notions and has been pushed aside by science because of that. Consequently, this important area of exploration has been neglected. Information theory has come to the rescue without dragging in the confusing psycho-social baggage that has impeded efforts to better understand nature's constructive side, without implying anthropomorphic intent. These guys have identified the ingredients of a proper thesis and pointed to an association with the 2nd Law (entropy) as some kind of evolutionary extension to it. As an engineer, it has always bothered me that there are short and long alternative pathways that the inevitable increase in entropy can take, while energy flows and degrades from hot stars into cold dark space. Even after ignoring the astronomical "waste" of energy that occurs as stars radiate their light into empty space, my human values see "lost potential" when sunlight is simply absorbed by an inert landscape to immediately become waste heat, when it might have been diverted into performing functional stuff like powering the processes of life or of civilisation. Certainly the potential for the evolution of functional information always exists wherever entropy might increase via a less rapid path than the simplest examples. This is the "entropic space" where everything interesting in the universe takes place, yet we know so little about it because it boggles our minds. It makes me wonder if there is something wrong with the metaphors we use to think about entropy, order, and functional information. The first impediment to common place understanding has to be this notion of something always increasing - even if it is something like "disorder". That concept sounds like life could never come to exist in such a universe. Alternatively we see summaries like Ginsberg's Theorem (copied from wikipedia):— 1. There is a game, which you are already playing. (consequence of zeroth law of thermodynamics) 2. You cannot win in the game. (consequence of first law of thermodynamics) 3. You cannot break even in the game. (consequence of second law of thermodynamics) 4. You cannot even quit the game. (consequence of third law of thermodynamics)
The Methodological Flaw of Applying Forensic Accounting to Sovereign Finance
A forensic accounting lens when applied to the analysis of a sovereign monetary system is inherently narrow and misleading. While valuable for tracking legal compliance and reconciling transactions within well-defined boundaries, forensic accounting is a static, fragmentary tool. It examines the ledger entries between institutions as if each were a self-contained entity operating in isolation. In the context of sovereign finance, this approach ignores the real-world process of how money is created, both over time and through its underlying structure. By freezing the analytical frame at the point of a single transaction—Treasury spending, bond issuance, or tax collection—this approach obscures the broader monetary sequence that makes these flows possible in the first place. It treats the U.S. Treasury, the Fed, and commercial banks as if they were unrelated entities interacting at arm’s length, rather than components of an integrated state–private financial architecture. This framing is especially problematic because, in operational terms, the state—through the combined and coordinated actions of its fiscal arm (the Treasury) and its monetary arm (the Fed)—is the sole issuer of the national currency. It is not merely a participant in the monetary system; it is its foundation. When this consolidation is ignored, a central fallacy emerges: the belief that the Treasury must “secure” funds before it can spend. This inversion of causality distorts the actual sequence of events. In reality, the private sector’s holdings of dollars and bank reserves—the very assets used to purchase government bonds—exist only because they were first injected into the system by state spending or lending. Without prior currency issuance by the state, there would be no stock of dollars available to purchase anything. Forensic accounting, by focusing on the legal order of transactions rather than their economic genesis, mistakes the rules of the game for the nature of the game itself. The consequences of this methodological myopia are far from innocent. First, it justifies the neoclassical but incorrect narrative that “taxes and bonds fund spending.” This is not a harmless misunderstanding; it frames public spending as dependent on prior revenue collection, precisely as it is for a household or firm. Such an analogy is false, but its repetition shapes public discourse, constrains fiscal policy, and fuels austerity arguments. Second, it misrepresents the nature of government securities. In operational terms, bond issuance in a sovereign, fiat currency system functions as a reserve-management tool: it drains excess reserves from the banking system and swaps one form of state liability (reserves) for another (bonds). This is an asset swap for the private sector, not a borrowing operation that “funds” the government in the same way a bank loan funds a household or business.
0 likes • Aug '25
I am on your side Demetrios, but I do not think the "methodolgy" (forensic accounting) is the correct target. The evidence is the evidence. It is how that evidence is framed or arranged that changes the interpretation. In a continuous looping process, you can can start your narrative wherever it suits, to create the appearance of causality you desire. You might be making an argument like macro has emergent properties which are not in the micro - but I don't think that applies in this case. It is not really like we are trying to prove or disprove ecological principles using evidence from chemistry. Not all good ideas work out.
1 like • Aug '25
@Demetrios Gizelis Legally, reserves are not money so money is not created until some private non-bank has its account credited. Once taxes are collected, those funds are no longer money, even 'though they may be credited to Treasury's reserve account. The balancing entries in the back room of the reserve system tend to be a continuous flow of somewhat circular transactions, so it is not possible to say that any particular dollar of retail money was the result of new bond sales or old. All we know is that the Treasury General Account (as they call it in the US) is replenished both by taxation and bond sales, and both of these require pre-existing reserves to be transferred to the TGA. Reserves are not money, but liquid financial assets which are interchangeable with Treasury bonds, if you are a bank. The flaw in the forensic accounting explanation is that it is spin. You and I can compose an equally plausible sequence that creates the impression that the treasury has to spend first in order to supply the reserves needed for banks to buy bonds. (Only the initial balance of the TGA requires that the Fed issue reserves to somebody before Treasury can get hold of them.) You would be correct to say that "forensic accounting" is inconclusive and does not prove whether the chicken laid the egg or the egg produced the chicken. What we do know for sure is that the Treasury branch of the government creates financial assets (bonds) which the Reserve Bank branch of the government is happy to exchange for liquid financial assets (reserves), some of which are used as balancing entries for the fiat money that the treasury puts into private bank accounts. The Treasury reserve account does not match any monetary entries, it just makes up some of the government's unlimited supply of financial assets - however the rules do require that Treasury spends reserves rather than using bonds as if they are liquid assets. There are some other complicating rules designed to make things look like the government is borrowing private funds, but, when we forensically follow the changes in financial equity, it becomes apparent that government spending creates financial equity for the private sector and taxation destroys it. The government's financial equity changes by exactly the opposite quantity that private equity changes.
The MMT Fallacy
For those that don't want to read this entire post, let's not bury the lead: MMT is wrong: - The U.S. does not have a spend and then tax system, we have a tax then spend system - The U.S. Treasury does not issue the U.S Dollar - The Fed does not issue reserves for the Treasury to spend - The Fed does not issue new reserves to pay the Gov's bills directly - The Gov cannot spend before receiving tax receipts or revenue from bond sales Below I explain in detail exactly why. Please let me know if you think I made any mistakes. After many, many hours of discussions with friends here and elsewhere, I think it’s finally becoming clear, I have finally gotten to the bottom of the MMT debate, so please let me know if you agree. We can have a tax and spend system, which many people believe we have today, and under a tax and spend system in 2024, the USG would have taxed roughly $5T and spent roughly $7T, showing a roughly $2T deficit, and the Gov would have had to borrow roughly $2T to cover the deficit spending. Or we can have a spend then tax system, which MMT believes we have today, and in 2024 the USG would have issued and spent $7T and taxed back $5T, showing a $2T deficit, as the USG spent $2T more than they received back in tax revenue. Two different systems that in practice don’t matter much until you have a deficit. Under a tax and spend model, to cover deficit spending the Gov has to borrow, because desired spending exceeds tax receipts. Under a spend first then tax back model, the Gov already spent the $, so the deficit is covered by issuing money, no borrowing or debt, the deficit is created because tax receipts are lower than currency issued and already spent, so all the money issued is not all taxed back. Which model we have is the heart of the MMT debate. A currency issuer always has a liability for the currency they issue, which means when they issue their currency they increase their Liabilities on their Balance Sheet, and when they receive their currency back as payment, they reduce their Liabilities. If they receive 100% of the currency they issued back as payment, their Liabilities go to zero and all currency is removed form circulation.
0 likes • Jul '25
@Jon Underwood "..there are no reserves today that are a result of the Fed buying from the UST." YES, YES, YES. I never said there was, but you keep assuming I am saying things that I am not saying. "the TGA NEVER does that" - does what? - spend money into the economy before it can tax some of it back? Ultimately, new spending derives from selling bonds to banks who got those excess reserves from recent government spending. The TGA is replenished after the spending. You see the first spend as being tax revenue, and not new spending, you see the *next* spend as the deficit spend, but we are only arguing about which part of the wheel pulls the rest of the wheel around. If after spending $5B, only $1B of bonds are sold, then $5B spend and another $1B of bond sales, which $2B are "new" money? New reserves ARE issued when banks feel the need to swap some bonds for liquidity at the Fed. Banks are likely to feel that need when their reserves deplete as their customers pay their taxes. The TGA can spend more than it has in reserves because, after it spends some existing funds, the banks have new excess reserves with which to buy new bonds. No new reserves are needed in order to deficit spend, so it all happens without Treasury needing to sell bonds to the Fed to get new reserves. The banks do eventually swap bonds for reserves at the Fed, as the private sector pays its taxes. I grant you that IORB has reduced the propensity for banks to buy bonds, but that simply reduces that annoying "multiplier" that I keep talking about. Even at a reserve ratio of 20%, the government can spend up to 5 times the amount that it taxes, which is ample. If the interest on reserves is high enough for liquid assets to be more attractive than bond assets (less volatile or higher return), then the reserve ratio could increase to the point where Treasury has to push harder so sell its new bonds - lower price, higher return - to prevent the reserve ratio from increasing. The interest rate is set by the Fed, but bonds now have to compete with a non trivial interest rate.
0 likes • Jul '25
@Jon Underwood We have long been together that new reserves are only marked up by the Fed upon the receipt of assets such as bonds. But you seem to have a problem with my usage of "new money" when the Treasury deficit spends. Perhaps we are getting closer to why we keep misunderstanding each other. It has something to do with "new money"! When I talk about "new money" in the context of government spending, I am talking about deficit spending, transferring government equity to the private sector. This shifting of government equity into the deposits of the private sector is where new money comes from. The process requires the use of reserves to transfer financial assets into bank accounts, but an increase in the money supply does not require an increase in the volume of total reserves. It does, however, require an increase in the total assets and an increase in government liabilities (bonds). Could it be that you equate "new money" with creating new reserves? "Unless the Fed expands their Balance Sheet, and increases their liabilities on their ledger, so a net increase in total reserves, there is no new money." This does not work for me. Reserves does not equal Money. Bank assets which support the fiat money supply consist of a combination of reserves and bonds. So long as the sum of both matches the fiat money liabilities of the banks, then the value of reserves can go up and down as the value of bonds held by the banks goes down and up. Do you think this is close to the root of our disagreements and misunderstandings?
Bank Led QE, And The End Of QT?
At the end of the quarter June 30th, banks went to the Fed and swapped assets for $11b, increasing Fed liabilities and increasing the supply of reserves. There are other signs of tightening liquidity, but this was a shock as nothing like this has happened in the last 5 years. There was one day I think in 2022 where banks borrowed maybe $2.9b from the Fed? (It’s in the video). Most days in the last 5 years banks borrow nothing from the Fed, they only borrow from each other using overnight repurchase agreements, pledging bonds overnight to borrow enough reserves to complete payments or meet regulatory requirements overnight. Swapping assets for reserves provides banks liquidity. Banks settle roughly $3T in reserve transactions a day, so $11b from the Fed is not a huge number, but it means that banks could not find enough reserves in the market to borrow from each other, so they had to pay more and go to the Fed. Banks can borrow what they need from the Fed, supply is unlimited at the Fed funds rate, but banks charge each other less (SOFR), and no bank wants to go to the Fed to swap assets and borrow to increase bank liquidity, there is a stigma for the borrowing bank.. People wonder what is the minimum number of reserves needed to run the financial system. The Fed has expanded their Balance Sheet using Quantitative Easing and during Covid it reached $9T. The Fed has been trying to reduce their BS since through Quantitative Tightening, and after selling more than $2T in assets and allowing maturing securities to roll off their BS, it appears the Fed may have hit their lower limit. On June 30th, banks expanded the Fed’s BS by swapping $11b in assets for new reserves, and this may signal to the Fed that they need to stop QT, and start easing. This may put pressure on the Fed to cut rates quicker than they had anticipated. I am posting a link to a great video that explains more, but the market is wondering what this means, and how the Fed will respond. Anybody here tracking this?
0 likes • Jul '25
I don't have time to watch the video, but I can make stuff up, like anybody else. I gather banks get 4.4% IORB. So perhaps bonds are looking risky relative to a nice secure interest rate. Demand for bonds is likely to weaken - it must have already because this process has the dynamics of a landslide. 1) reserves are more attractive than they used to be because they earn interest; 2) foreigners are starting to dump their USD assets (I just made that up, but it's plausible); 3)Treasury will be selling new bonds to finance Tump's new big beautiful deficit. All these forces are in the direction of lots of bonds looking for buyers, so you don't want to get caught out holding the parcel. When the bond prices hit bottom the banks will start buying them again to benefit from the high yields. But I'm forgetting about the Fed holding up the price of bonds. How much can the Fed spend on assets that are worth less than they are obliged to pay? Can it buy all the bonds in the world? That would be a very big balance sheet. Somebody might start to think that IORB was a bad idea. What happens then?
0 likes • Jul '25
I failed to add 4) there are reasons to think inflation may increase. High government deficits, climate related disasters, and increasing social and economic disruption wil push up inflation. All of 1) to 4) point to the fed raising interest rates in the near to medium term.
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