Nobody in this community needs convincing that conversion rate isn't the whole story. Profit per visitor over CVR, we mostly get it. When we had @Luka Nikolić on Live with Intelligems recently, the interesting part wasn't the pitch for it, it was how much time he spent on why it's so hard to actually run a program this way. His answer came down to data and financial literacy. Getting profit into a test means getting COGS out of a client, and that's a harder conversation than it sounds, especially when they aren't used to sharing it. He's had to fight for those uploads. An agency can run a retainer for months, tweaking buttons, and never touch the number that actually decides whether the business is healthier, because nobody ever put the real financials in front of them. His pitch was to close the laptop on the AI tools for a bit and go read the boring spreadsheets instead. Return rates, supplier terms, how customers actually segment. The unglamorous stuff practitioners tend to skip is usually where the profit lever is hiding. His line for it: "revenue is vanity, profit is sanity." The full interview is attached below if you want to watch the whole conversation. Curious where this community lands. For those tracking profit per visitor, how did you get COGS out of a client who didn't want to hand it over? Have you ever shipped a test that won on conversion rate and later realized it hurt margin? And is there a "boring spreadsheet" you've gone into that ended up reshaping what you tested next?